果冻出品：凯蒂 "跟上现实深度访谈（连载15）

starinheart

版权归作者所有，任何形式转载请联系作者。
作者：果冻.Angela（来自豆瓣）
来源：https://www.douban.com/note/695759808/

ear, Morining. ：）

接上~

JoB:

Why do you emphasize writing down the questions as oppose to just doing them in your head?

为什么你强调要把念头写下来，而不是直接在头脑中做呢？

Katie:

Well, you mean the concepts that woking with?(Yeah.Right) . I ask people to write , to identify their stressful thoughts(Right) and put it on paper, and that way the mind is stopped. Stressful concept you're believing are stopped, they're there. And your mind can go on and say "I really didn't mean that, I meant something else. It doesn't matter what it did, what it thinks. There it is! So, undeniably.You know, who thought it? Who wrote it? Oh, that was you, that's it, you know it. And no matter what your mind does with it, there it is. It can deny it , but  there it is. So then you just . It's still, it stopped.

嗯，你是说那些需要做功课的念头么？（是的）我让人们通过书写的方式，将他们有压力的念头识别出来（是的），将它们写在纸面上。这样一来，念头就停止了。那些你所相信的有压力的念头就停止了，它们就在纸面上，它们就在那儿。然后，你的念头会继续说，“我其实不是那个意思，我是说别的意思。”等等。无论它怎么辩解，那些念头就在纸面上写着呢，所以是不可否认的。要知道，谁想的那些念头呢？又是谁把它写下来的呢？哦，是你，就这样。你知道的。无论你的念头想要怎么样，黑纸白字就在那儿摆着呢。心念可以否认，但是事实就摆在眼前。所以，嗯，念头安静下来，它停止了。

People want to stop their mind for centuries and centuries and centuries and centuries, and they never new how.So there it is, stopped, mind on paper, stopped. You know,bring it out of mind into the physical world that mind imagines that exists, that exsits. Put it on paper and question that, you've seen the four questions and turn around, and no matter what happens with other concepts, just notice, write them somewhere else and come back to that one. Do all four questions and turnaround. And no turnarounds without the questions first, because the questions, uh ,the turnarounds become a bitch word and an ineffective, without the four questions.(Right) It's not,  that's not helpful. But eventually the work doesn't work. Why? because you're not answering the questions, you're taking a short cut, which again, it's okay. It's just that if it stops working for you, it's because you have stopped working it.(Right)

几个世纪以来，人们一直想要让念头停止下来，但是人们却不知道该怎么做。所以，写下来，停止了，念头写在纸面上，停止了。你知道的，将念头从头脑中提取出来，落实在头脑所认知的客观世界的纸面上，头脑所以为的真实世界中。写在纸上，用四个问题和反转来质询它们。在功课的过程中，不过冒出什么其他的念头，只是观察它们就好了，并把这些念头也写在其他的纸上，然后再回到刚才的念头上。要把所有的四个问题和反转都全部做完才行。不可以跳过四个问题，直接去反转。因为那四个问题，嗯，如果没有先质询四个问题，那么反转就会变成是一种挖苦的话，也没有效果。（是的）那样做是没有帮助的。。而且最终功课也不起效果。为什么？因为你没有回答那四个问题， 因为你抄近路了。当然，这样做也是可以的。只不过，如果功课对你没有发挥作用，那只可能是因为你停止了去做它。（是的）

So, uh, the four questions and the turnaround, and you find three examples for the turnaround. So the mind has an opportunity to see how the opposites, or if the opposites are as true or truer. They always are.. They always are to the opne mind. And uh, and open mind, open heart. Closed mind ,closed heart. People who harm themselves and other human beings have closed minds. It's not their fault, they're simply believing their thoughts.

所以，嗯，四个问题和反转，你再针对反转找出3个例子。所以，这样一来心念就有机会去看看反面的情况是怎样的，或者说反面的情况是不是也一样真实或者更加真实。它们总是真实或更真实的。。它们总是。。对于开放的心念来说，它们总是真实的或更加真实的。嗯，念头开放，心也开放；念头封闭，心也封闭。那些伤害自己和其他人的人们持有者封闭的念头。这并不是他们的错，他们只是相信了他们的想法而已。

When I go into penitentiaries(监狱), hardcore prisons, work with the lifersz(无期徒刑犯), uh, you know, it's simple to see why they're in there，when I understand what they were believing when it happened. And I was sharing with them with an , uh ,an interviewer, uh from Israel today, earlier this morning, uh ,that An American in an Israeli prison for murdering his girlfriend, sentenced for life.And he sent me a thank-you note, there are some people there that take the work into prisons, and all over the place, Muslims, Jews,  they're just doing the it in Isarel.It's, it's wonderful to see what they're doing with the work there.(Um-hm).

当我去监狱、监牢里面，与那些被判无期的犯人做功课的时候，你知道，当我理解了那些事情发生的时候他们所相信的那些念头，很容易就能明白为什么他们会在那里。今天早上早些时候，我和一个以色列的记者分享了这些犯人的案例。有一个关在以色列监狱里的美国人，他因为杀害了自己的女友被判无期，他让别人带给我一个感谢的口信。在监狱里有很多人都在做功课，到处都有人做功课，穆斯林、犹太人、他们就是在以色列做功课。嗯，我很高兴能够看到他们能够在监狱中做功课。（嗯）

But he was thanking me for the peace that he is , that he has found.He murdered his girlfriend because she didn't think he was enough, she didn't think he was worthy, and on and on and on. And he murdered her. And um he became so angry. So he was doing the work in prison with my friend Arry and he found that his girlfriend, yet no proof she ever believed that. She never said that to him, She never gave him cause that she believed it. He was simply believing it about himself, and projecting it onto her.

他谢谢我带给他的平静，他找到了内心的平静。他杀害了他的女友，就是因为女友认为他不够好，她认为他配不上她，诸如此类的等等原因。他谋杀了她。嗯，他变得非常气愤。所以，当他和我的朋友艾伦在监狱中做功课的时候，他发现他根本没有证据能够证明他的女友是那样想的。她从没有那样说过他，她也从没有任何那样想的理由。他只是单纯地这么认为自己，然后就将自己所认为的事情投射到女友身上了。

So when we believe just a simple thought, like she doesn't think I'm worthy, or she doesn't think I'm enough. A simple thought like that, when you believe it, and the mind gives you all the proof...You know, it's not a little thing.

所谓，当我们哪怕只是相信了一个简单的念头，比如 “她认为我不配”，或者“她认为我不够好”等等。像这样一个简单的念头，当你相信它的时候，念头会给你提供所有的证据，，，，，然后，你知道，这并不是一件小事。

When a person writes down, they identify and write their thoughts on paper, especially people who are depressed or angry, you know, if they would just question their thoughts, oh my goodness, they, their identities would shift so quickly that they wouldn't have to do prison, they don't have to do that kind of  time.(Right) And those of us that are not in prison, are we locked in to the prison of our minds? And you know, people don't like to be locked up in prison, because what they're locked up with, is their thoughts, and other than that, prison's great. (What? I've just gonna say..) If you put a Buddhist monk in there, and lock him in, and he says" thank you".(Right.)

当人们将念头写下来，他们识别并在纸上写下他们的想法，尤其是那些绝望的或者愤怒的人们更应该这样，你知道，如果他们能够只是质询一下他们的念头，哦我的天，他们，他们的身份就会快速转变，而不至于坐牢。他们根本不必去这样来度过余生。（是的）而我们这些没有被关进牢房的人，难道我们没有被锁在自己的念头中么？要知道，人们不喜欢被关进监牢。因为和他们一起被锁住的，是他们的想法。没有那些念头和想法，监狱是不错的。（什么？我刚想说。。）如果你将一个佛教的和尚关进牢房，并锁上门，他会说“谢谢。”（是的）

And I walked through prisons , there's ah, in Clinton, there is a one of the old old old places, uh, they call Broadway, because it's a full of,  that sometimes they, they have to say just pack them in. I mean they don't even have cells and they're just all over the floor, on mattresses, it's , it's really quite something that . So I'm in there and I hear, you know, they lock someone up, you hear the door slam, and you look up, and it's just layers of , you know, just tiers of rows, of cells.. And you hear one shut, I heard one shut, way up above to the ride, and he started screaming, and then another one goes off, another one goes off..

我去过克林顿地区的很多监狱，嗯，那里有一座非常非常非常老旧的监狱，他们管那座监狱叫做“百老汇”，因为到处都挤满了人。有时候，他们，不得不说说把犯人挤在一起。我的意思是他们甚至没有自己的单间，只是人挨人挤在地板的垫子上面。那真是难以言喻的情况。所以，我去到那里，我听见，你知道，他们把一个人关起来，你能听见那个关门的声音，然呢你向上面看，那里是一层层的牢房，你知道一排排一列列的牢房。。。你听见关门的响声，我听见那个关门声，就在楼上的某个地方，然后那个犯人开始尖叫，接着另一个人开始尖叫，接着又一个人开始发疯尖叫。。。

And what's happening is they're believing their thoughts. That is the ONLY reason the person would even scream. I mean, again, look what they're locked up with,and they're, if they're,you know, there's nothing available to them to shift the mind, like with a cigarette or shopping credit card, sex, there's nothing.They're just stuck with it, and nothing to do with it.(No credit cards.) And there they are, you know, the thought " I need to get out of here", that is torture when you can't get out and you believe it. "I can't live in here" this will kill me, that is torrure, when there's no way out and you believe it. You believe , uh ,what you're thinking.

而当时所发生的事情，只不过是他们相信了自己的想法而已。那就是在当时那个人会尖叫的唯一原因。还是那句话，我的意思是，看看他们被和什么锁在一起了。他们，嗯，如果他们，要知道，在监狱里没有什么可以让他们来转变念头，比如香烟、购物信用卡或者性等，什么都没有。他们只能是与自己的念头锁在一起，毫无办法。（哦，没有信用卡。。）他们，你知道，那个念头“我要离开这里” 是一种折磨，当你无法离开而你却相信了自己要离开的时候，那就是一种折磨。当你出不去的时候，相信了“我不能待在这里”的这个念头会杀了我，那真的是一种折磨。你相信了你所想的念头。

So now, with the work in prisons, uh, these prisoners are becoming freer than people on the outside of prison, and I love that. Because it's true rehabilitation, when we're ,when we don't believe our stressful thoughts.The thoughts would harm ourselves and  other human being. Those are the stress, uh ,stressful ones, or the thoughts that project others,,, you know, our own suffering because he/she, etc...

所以现在，能够在监狱里做功课，这些犯人变得越来越自由，比在监狱外面的人还要自由。我非常欣慰。因为那才是真正的重新做人。当我们不再相信那些有压力的想法时，不再相信那些会伤害我们自己以及别人的想法，那些充满压力的念头，或者投射到其他人身上的，你知道，比如“我的痛苦都是因为他/她，，，” 等等这些念头。

starinheart

版权归作者所有，任何形式转载请联系作者。
作者：果冻.Angela（来自豆瓣）
来源：https://www.douban.com/note/695759808/

When these prisoners the ones, that will get out eventually and they, some of them do get out, whether they're rehabilitated or not, uh, they just convince people that the parole board(假释裁决委员会) that they're okay, and they believe it themselves, and they're very convincing. But, the thoughts that put them in there in the first place(They're there.).They're still running, they still believe them. And they find 12 STEPs there, they find religion there, they find,, you know , God there, they find all kinds of wonderful things. And they feel so elevated, and they feel so~ rehabilitated and so fine, and their whole body shifts, they look so~ different , because they have God, we'll say. Okay, so they're let out of prison, and if their mind doesn't focus on that, then what happens is ,what they believe that put them in there in the first place, it overrides EVERYTHING.(Right) " I'm not enough...No one cares...I need a partner... No one understands me....uh,, I need...I want....I should.. They shouldn't...." And they end up behind bars again, and someone gets hurt. They get hurt and someone gets hurt.

当这些犯人之中，那些最终可以出狱的人，他们当中有些人最终服刑期满可以被释放的人，无论是不是真的重新做人了，嗯，他们只是说服了假释裁决委员会他们已经洗心革面了，他们也相信自己真的改变了，他们看起来真的让人相信已经变了。但是，最初将他们投入监狱的那些念头（还在那儿。。），它们依旧在头脑中盘旋着，他们还是相信着那些念头。他们在监狱中找到了12个步骤练习、找到了宗教信仰、找到了，嗯，你知道，他们找到了上帝，他们找到了所有这些神奇的事情。同时，他们也真的觉得自己进步了很多，他们觉得自己真的是脱胎换骨了，变得如此的好，整个身体都在发生变化，，，，比如说，因为相信了上帝，所以他们看起来与之前是如此的不同。好吧，所以，就这样他们被释放了。如果他们的心念无法专注在那些美好的信仰上面，那么接下来发生的，就是最初让他们进监狱的那些念头，它压倒了一切。（对的）比如“我不够好，，，，没有人在乎我，，，，我需要一个伴侣，，，，没有人能够理解我。。。。嗯，，，，我需要，，我想要，，，我应该，，，他们不应该，，，，” 最终，他们又再次被关进了监狱，同时有人受到了伤害。犯人受了伤害，而其他人也受了伤害。

So until uh, until people know how to question their minds, we can see through, uh, through history,that nothing is changing.And then when we look at the people that are not in prison. We're only out of prison because we didn't get caught.(Right.) You know, but we're all running the stuff and passing it on to our children and each other.But we're justified. And every one behind bars is justified because that's how the mind works.Whatever we do, the mind will defend it and justify it. And that's where the war begins. Defense is the first act of war. (Right)

所以说，除非，除非人们能够知道怎样质询自己的念头，，，我们回顾这些历史可以看到，否则他们是无法改变的。让我们回过头来看看那些没有被关进监狱的人们。我们没有被关进监狱只是因为我们没有被抓住而已。（是的）。你知道，可是我们都在想着和罪犯同样的念头，并将这些念头传播给我们的孩子以及我们彼此。但是我们却给自己找到了正当理由。每一个被关进监狱的人也都有自己的正当理由，因为那就是心智的运作模式。不管我们做什么，心智总是会维护它并为它找到正当理由。而那也是战争开始的地方。防卫就是战争的第一步。（是的）

So if someone says," Katie, you did it." My first thought is " They're right,now let me check it out." rather than" They're wrong, let me check it out."(Mm-hm) Because you know, uh, why would someone lie? They wouldn't lie about it. And if I can't see where I did it, then yeah, I'm perfectly open to understanding why they believe that I did it. Look at what for that , look at what they're thinking.So, no one is wrong when they say," Katie, you did it." So ,there's no war in my life. There cannot be,as far as I know.

所以如果有人说，“凯蒂，这事儿都怪你。”我的第一个念头是 “他们说的对，让我来看看他们哪儿说对了”，而不是“他们说错了，让我来看看他们哪儿说错了。”（嗯）因为要知道，嗯，为什么别人要撒谎呢？他们没必要就那件事撒谎的啊。如果我确实不能找到我哪儿错了，嗯，我会非常开放地去理解他们，理解他们为什么会认为是我做的。看看为什么会那样，看看他们此刻在想着什么。所以，如果有人说：“凯蒂，这事儿都怪你”的时候，是不会错的。所以，我的生活中没有战争，据我所知也不可能发生战争。

JoB:

I mean I can get that I'm like the prisoner, you know? (Oh, Yeah~anyone gets bored is in big trouble..) Anyone gets...?

我想我能明白我和那个犯人想的一样，你了解吧？（哦，当然。任何一个感觉厌倦的人都有大麻烦）嗯，你说任何人怎样？

Katie:

Bored, is in big trouble. And by that I mean, they don't know how to deal with their thoughts.They don't know how to deal with what they're thinking. So they have to do something to shift the mind.(Right) Because they don't like what they're thinking.They're not bored, they're not liking what they think.So not knowing how to deal with that, or even recognizing that it's their thinking, they think it's life. And it's not, that's their thoughts about life. That's how lost we are as a human race, as a mind.They have to shift that. They have to shift it. And we do it in the most amazing way. We call people we don't like.... we marry people we don't like...simply because we don't want to be alone.... simply because we fear... It's um, it's a vey,, and no wonder why we're bitter and then we blame each other. It's, you know, it's quite a circle.

觉得无聊厌烦，都有大麻烦。我的意思是说，他们不知道如何去处理他们的念头。他们不知道如何去处理他们的想法。所以他们不得不做点什么来改变那个念头。（是的）因为他们不喜欢他们所想的东西。他们不是觉得厌烦，他们只是不喜欢他们所想的事情。所以，不知道怎么样去处理它，甚至没有意识到那只是他们的想法。他们认为那是生活。而实际上那不是，那只是他们关于生活的想法而已。那就是我们作为人类，作为一个念头，该有多么的迷失自己啊。嗯，我们会给自己不喜欢的人打电话，，，我们会嫁给自己不喜欢的人，，，只是因为我们不想孤单，，，只是因为我们害怕。。嗯，那是，那真的，，怪不得我们会变得更痛苦，然后彼此责备呢。要知道，这真的是一种轮回。

JoB:

Wow...

哇。。

Katie:

And you know, not everyone but the people who don't live in ways that I've just described, live in other ways.Anyone that is bored, confused, angry, sad, ,, you know, It's just absolutely unnecessay if their mind is open, open to the work. And it is necessary until the mind is open to that.(Right).

你知道，并不是每个人都生活在我刚才所描述的生活状态中，有些人是活在另一种状态中的。任何人，如果觉得厌烦了，困惑了，愤怒了，悲伤了，，，，要知道，如果他们的心念是开放的，能够对功课开放，这些情绪是根本不必要的，，，。同时，在念头能够对功课开放之前，这些情绪也是必要的。（对的）

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极速飞艇 现代医学研究表明，从榴莲汁液和果皮中提取出的蛋白水解酶， 口服后能加强体内纤维蛋白的水解，能将血液凝块溶解，改善体液的局部循环，从而使炎症和水肿消除，临床可用作抗水肿和消炎药。榴莲蛋白酶与抗菌素、化疗药物并用，能促进药物对病灶的渗透，可用于多种原因导致的炎症、水肿和血栓等病症，如支气管炎、急性肺炎、乳腺炎、视网膜炎等。据报道，榴莲果皮治疗老年性瘙痒病的疗效较好榴莲的营养价值很高，它含有很高的糖份，并且含淀粉11%，糖分13%，蛋白质3%，还有多种维生素，脂肪，钙，铁和磷等。身体虚弱的朋友可以食用榴莲，榴莲可以补充身体需要的能量和营养，达到强身健体、滋阴补阳的功效。病后及妇女产后可用之来补养身体榴莲果中氨基酸的种类齐全，含量丰富，除色氨酸外，还含有7种人体必需氨基酸，其中，谷氨酸含量特别高。动物实验进一步证明，谷氨酸是核酸、核苷酸、氨基糖和蛋白质的重要前体，参与其合成代谢，能提高机体的免疫功能，调节体内酸碱平衡，以及提高机体对应激的适应能力。幸运飞艇 榴莲果对人体有强壮补益作用的原因，除含有较丰富的有益元素锌等以外，还应与其含有的香气成分及其他营养成分起协同作用榴莲的营养价值很多，它还可以缓解痛经。因为榴莲是热性水果，因此食用后可以起到活血散寒、缓解经痛的作用。榴莲的热性可以改善腹部寒凉的情况，促进体温上升，对寒性体质的朋友非常有帮助此外，维生素A还有能抑制肿瘤形成的抗启动基因的活性，起到抑癌抗癌的作用。维生素B是体内多种氧化酶系统不可缺少的辅基部分，参与氧化还原反应和能量代谢。维生素C在机体中具有广泛的生理功能，它能增强人体免疫功能，预防和治疗缺铁性贫血、恶性贫血及坏血病，促进胶原的形成和类固醇的代谢，有利于维持骨骼和牙齿的正常功能，抗衰老、抑制亚硝酸盐与胺合成亚硝胺，具有防癌功效等