奥普拉（Oprah）对凯蒂（Katie）的专访1（中英版-果冻） ...

starinheart

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Oprah: I remember in the middle of the night, being too tired to wake up to even I was like groggy and wanted to ask security to bring some water, but too tired to reach for the phone, even say bring me some water. So I was really sick.(Katie:mm-hmm). And suddenly I had the thought after reading your book, I'm gonna stop resisting being sick, I'm gonna to let it, I'm gonna, , because I'm trying not to be sick. (Katie:Yes). I mean, in the middle of sick, I "uh, I can't believe I was dadadada." I suddenly had the thought or feeling that I'm gonna release my resistance to being sick, I'm going to embrace it.  (Katie:Yes). I said I'm going to embrace，it makes me want to cry, thinking about it. I said I'm going to embrace it, (Katie:Yes), and see what happens. I fell asleep and I woke up miraculous security.

奥普拉：我记得在半夜的时候，我极度疲惫地醒过来，摇摇晃晃地、跌跌撞撞地想要叫保安给我送一些水过来。但是我太难受了，甚至都够不着电话，更别说拨打电话让别人给我拿水了。所以，我真的病的很严重。（凯蒂：嗯。）然后，我突然想起刚读过的你那本《一念之转》里面的一些启示。我想，我要放弃防卫，放弃抵抗生病这回事，随它去吧。我要，嗯，因为我当时一直努力不想让自己生病。（凯蒂：是的。）我的意思是，在生病的过程中我还在一直抵抗自己生病的这个事实，我当时想着。“”哦，天，我不相信我怎么会这样，我不可以生病。。。巴拉巴拉巴拉“。然后，我突然有了那个想法，或者说感受到那个想法，即，我要放下对生病这个事实的抵抗，我要拥抱这个事实。（凯蒂：是的。）哦，我刚才我说要拥抱生病这个事实的时候，想起这个让我有点想哭。我说我要拥抱这个事实。（凯蒂：是的。）我想看看接下来会发生什么事情。结果，我睡着了，然后第二天早上奇迹一般地醒过来，完全康复了。

Katie: It's, it is amazing to love what is. See, that's the description .

凯蒂：嗯，是什么就爱什么是非常美妙的。看吧，那就是关于这样做的一个描述。

Oprah: I wouldn't have thought , I would have been able to get out of bed in the next three days. I think how am I gonna get to work, how am I gonna to fly back across country...

奥普拉：我当时根本没想到在接下来的三天里，我还能起得来床。我想的是，我怎么去工作啊，我怎么坐飞机回家啊。

Katie: Oh, I have a goose bumps,you, you stopped arguing with reality.

凯蒂：哦，你的故事让我非常感动，你，嗯，你停止了与事实的抗辩。

Oprah: I stopped fighting it.

奥普拉：是的，我停止了与它对抗。

Katie: It's a magical world. And then if you get still and you go back and you look at how your body really was, and you look back, was that pain? was it really pain? Or was it , was it something else?(Oprah: I don't know. I don't know what it was). That was quite pleasant. (Oprah: Yeah,absolutely!). Yeah, it's like what we are calling sadness, or, or, or, you know, sadness, I invite people to question that. Is it sadness or is it love. And to get really still, are those feelings, sadness? Or are they love？like when a loved one dies. And to get really honest about it, maybe it's love ,maybe it's not sadness.

凯蒂：那是一个奇妙的世界。然后，如果你静下来，再回头看那个事情，去看看当时你身体的真实状况，你静静地回看，那是疼痛么？那真的是疼痛么？或者。。或者那是什么别的东西？（奥普拉：我不知道，我不知道，我根本不知道那是怎么回事。）那是非常有趣的。（奥普拉：是啊，绝对的。）是啊，那就像是我们称呼悲伤一样，或者，或者，或者，你知道，悲伤。我邀请人们去质疑这个情绪。那是悲伤么？还是说那是爱？真的要完全地静静地去体会和质询那些情绪，它们是悲伤？还是爱？就像是说一个亲人死了的时候，我们所体会到的情绪。真的要诚实地去面对内心的质询，或许那是爱，或许那并不是悲伤。

starinheart

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Oprah: Well, I am gonna cry because I lost my dog Sophie and uh She'd been with 13 years, everyday, everyday,everayday, everywhere, and I was sitting alone this weekend just thinking about her, and I just passed a picture of her on the wall,and I had that ,that feeling , I mean, this is ,you know ,trying to be in touch with my really feeling ,with my really feeling.(Katie: Yes.) I miss her physical body,(Katie: Yes.) , because she slept on the bed every night . But what I am really feeling is a deep deep love for her.(Katie: Yes.) A deep love for her.(Katie: Yeah.). And wondering if I was able, this is the same thing ，I know everybody feels， when they lose a loved one ,and I would say Sophie is the closest, I was gonna say closest person , closest entity that I've lost.(Katie: Yeah.) You know, as an adult.

奥普拉：哦，这让我想到了我死去的小狗苏菲。13年来，它每天都和待在我在一起，每天每天每天，任何地方几乎都和我在一起。这个周末，我独自一个人呆着的时候，想起了她，当时我只是路过走廊看到了挂在墙壁上的它的照片，我体会到了你刚才说的那种感受。你知道，我努力想要触碰我自己的真实感受。（凯蒂：是的）。我想念它毛茸茸的身体。（凯蒂：是的）。因为它活着的时候每天都睡在我的床边。但是，我刚才体会到的，真的是一种对它深深的，深深的爱。（凯蒂：是的）。深深的爱。（凯蒂：是的）。然后，我一直在想，感受是一样，或许每个人在失去一个心爱的人的时候都会有的感受。我想说苏菲是我最亲密的，嗯，我想说最亲密的人，或者说我失去了我最亲密的宝贝。（凯蒂：是的。你知道，我把它当做一个朋友。

Oprah: And so I questioned whether or not .You know I did everything for this little dog. She's had a chemotherapy and two surgeries ,and the day she was getting another shunt for her neck, for her kidneys, and so forh, so i did everything for her. Now, I question was I fully present for her ?(Katie: Yeah.  It's like were you doing everything for her, to her？) I did everything for her..(Katie:Wasn't it for you?) Yeah,mm-hmm.(Katie: You know. was it more for you than Sophie , and It's just an interesting thing to look at.) Yeah.

奥普拉：所以，我质询了那种感受。你知道，我为这只小狗倾尽了全力。给它进行了化疗，动了两次手术，后来还切了喉管，靠引流喂食，等等。我几乎为她做了所有这些事情。现在，我在质询自己的是，我是否真的活在了那个当下？（凯蒂：是的。就好像你是“为她”做了一切，还是你“对她”做了一切？）我为她做了一切。（凯蒂：难道没有为了你自己么？）是的，嗯。。。（凯蒂：你知道，是不是更为了你自己多一些呢？嗯，这是一件有趣的事情，你可以去考察一下。）好吧。

Katie: But you know, as we, as we , as you discussed Sophie, I can see her , I don'e een know what kind of dog she was in the end. And I think I do. But I mean, yeah. But uh,as we think of her, don't you see her? I see her and I never met her. But you see her .So she died, is it  true? I mean , they don‘t die   ,and every time this this visit, they come to our mind, like Sophie comes to your mind, she hits your mind and then love happens. (Oprah: Right.). And we name it sadness. But all of those years, 13 being with Sophie are there.(Oprah: Are there.)And , and uh like you did with your sickness, if you allow  it, she never leaves.(Oprah: mm-hmm.) and that kind of love, you know. I like to say no one can leave me, they don't have that power. It's here, it's here in your mind. (Oprah: mm) And it hit your heart.

凯蒂：但是，你知道。就在我们，嗯，就在你刚才讨论苏菲的时候，我能够看见它。我甚至根本都不知道她是哪种类型的小狗。我想我确实看见它了。但是我的意思是，好吧。但是，就在我们想起它的时候，你没有看见她么？我看见她了，但是我之前从没见过它。但是，你确实看见她了，不是么？所以，它死了，这是真的么？我的意思是说，她们没有死。每一次，每一次这些画面在头脑中到访的时候，它们来到我们的头脑中，就像是苏菲进入你的脑海一样，它敲打你的心，而爱会油然而生。（奥普拉：是的）。我们将这种感受称之为悲伤。但是所有过去的那些时光，13年来你有苏菲陪伴的时光都在那儿啊！（奥普拉：是在那儿）。所以，就像你对你的疾病所做的那样，如果你允许她进入，她是永远都不会离开的。（奥普拉：嗯。。）。以及那个爱永远都不会离开。我喜欢说，没有人能够离开我，他们没有那个能力。它在你这儿，在你的心中。（奥普拉：嗯）。它会敲击你的心。

starinheart

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Oprah: Right, correct, correct, correct. all right, so let's see how this work with, let's see how the work works for an issue that has been troubling me for as long as I can remember.Actually I can remeber how long it's has been troubling me. My weight. You said that you were, because when I was reading this, I was saying, Oh, well , I need to write a book for how this work for a weight. I thought I had beat the weight game. I thought it was over  for me. and that I had it under control . And um, last year, it is true that I had with a doctor said,was,he said it was a thyroid issue. And I went to the doctor,and the doctor said to me,"Well, you're going to gain weight. You must learn to embrace hunger because you're going to gain weight." I couldn't believe this was happening to me.Who's had a quote weight issue in my whole life. And now I will go to the doctor who says you have an issue now, that's actually gonna make you gain weight. What I now think is, "I didn't have to gain weight!" But what I did iwas I believe the doctor.(Katie:Yes). I believe the doctors, So I stopped working out as much .(Katie:Yeah).I believe the doctor, so I just  (Katie:Yeah) sort of eating..not junking food.

奥普拉：对的，完全正确，是这么回事。好的，下面让我们看看这个功课怎么样解决，嗯，让我们来看看功课怎么来解决一个具体的问题，自打我有记忆开始，我就有了这个困扰。好吧，实际上我能够算出这个问题困扰了我多长时间，那就是我的体重问题。你说过，你。。嗯因为当我在读这本《一念之转》的时候，我对自己说，哦，天，我需要写本怎么用功课来减肥的书。我曾经以为我已经击败了肥胖的问题，我以为体重问题不会再找上我，我以为我已经完全掌控了自己的体重问题。嗯，但是去年，真的哦。我的医生和我说，他说我有甲状腺的问题，医生对我说，“哦，我认为你应该减肥了。你必须学会拥抱饥饿，因为你需要开始减重。” 我几乎不敢相信这怎么会发生在我的身上，我怎么会整个人生都被贴上肥胖的标签呢？现在我想要去找找那个医生，那个说我有体重问题、应该减肥的医生。我现在所想的是，“我根本不想减肥啊！” 。虽然我这么想，但是我所做的却是相信了医生的话。（凯蒂：是的）。我相信了医生的话，所以大大地缩减了我的工作量。（凯蒂：是的）。我相信了医生的话，所以我不吃那些垃圾食品了。（凯蒂：是的）。

Katie: Cause and effect. You believe and then the effect happens.

凯蒂：因和果。因为你相信了，所以你去做，这就是结果。

Oprah: Right. Okay, So in terms of the work, I am uh, I am sick of the struggle with with weight, I'm sick of it, I believe that is true.

奥普拉：对的。好吧。所以就功课来说，我，我，我受够了与体重作斗争。我受够了，我相信这是真的，我受够了。

Katie：Okay, So you're sick of weight being an issue in your life, can you absolutely know that it's true? that you're sick of it. You say you are, and can you absolutely know that it's true that you are sick of it.

凯蒂：好的。所以你受够了体重成为你生命中的一个问题，你能百分百确定这是真的么？你真的受够了么？你说你受够了，你能百分百确定你受够了么？

Oprah: Ah-ha.

奥普拉：是的。

Katie：Okay.（Oprah:Yes）. So  what happens to you when you think the thought I, I'm sick of the struggle in my life.

凯蒂：好的。(奥普拉：是的)。所以，当你想到那个念头，我受够了一生都在和体重抗争，想到这个念头的时候，发生了什么。

starinheart

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Oprah: what happens to me.. mm. I get frustrated, I have to, I get work, you know, I'm thinking about what I should ear of shouldn't eat, what I ate yesterday, what I shouldn't eaten yesterday,（Katie:Yes）,what I'm gonna eat look tomorrow.You know, three weeks from now I have something coming up with the party, Maya Angelous, will I eat there, will I drink there, will I have no champagne, will I emilate champagne? You know（Katie:Yeah),that's what I think.

奥普拉：发生了什么？嗯。我会变得很紧张，我不得不做点什么，你知道。我想到我应该吃什么，我不应该吃什么，我昨天吃了什么，我昨天是不是吃了不应该吃的。（凯蒂：嗯）。我想我明天要吃什么呢？你知道，三个礼拜以后我和玛雅.安吉路斯有个聚会，我在聚会上面要不要吃东西呢？要不要喝酒呢？我不能喝香槟了，或者干脆我就戒了香槟算了。。。。你知道（凯蒂：嗯）。那就是我想到的。

Katie: So what you think about your body, Oprah?

凯蒂：所以，你怎么看待自己的身材，奥普拉？

Oprah: What I think of it?

奥普拉：我怎么看？

Katie: Yeah, what do you think of it, how do you see it? ah，the stress why's. the stressful thought.

凯蒂：是的，你怎么想，你怎么看待自己的身体？嗯，就是为什么你会觉得身体是个压力。那些压力的念头是什么。

Oprah：I wish it were, I wish it were a size 10, and not a size 14.

奥普拉：我希望它，我希望它是10码，而不是14码。

Katie： Okay，so you think your body is too large. (Oprah: yes.)Okay, so is it true? Your body is too large? (Oprah: True for whom?) For you. (Oprah:Is it true fo me?)For you. Because that's all you're ever going to have to deal with.

凯蒂：好吧。你认为你的身材太胖了。（奥普拉：是的）好的。所以，那是真的么？你的身材太胖了？（奥普拉：对谁来说是真的呢？）对你。（奥普拉：对我来说是真的么?）是的，对你。因为你所有要面对的只有你自己而已。

Oprah: That's right.Cuz it's just my business.

奥普拉：你说的对，因为这是我的事儿。

Katie: There are people who weight less than you do, who think they're obese, people weigh a lot more than you do, they think they're..(Oprah:Is it true for me that I think my body is too large? ) is too large. (Oprah: Yeah,it is.) Okay.so your body is too large,. (Oprah:mm-hmm).Can you absolutely know that it's true, tht your body is too large?

凯蒂：可能会有些体重比你轻的人，认为自己是肥胖的；也可能会有些体重比你重的人，认为自己是..(奥普拉：我认为我的身体太胖了，这是真的么？嗯。。)真的么？（奥普拉：是的，是真的。）。好的，所以，你的身体太胖了。。（奥普拉：嗯。。）你能百分百确定那是真的么？你的身体太胖了？

Oprah: For me? Well, for my mind, it is. for my mind, it is.

奥普拉：对我来说么？好吧，我的头脑是这么认为的，是的，太胖了。对我的头脑而言，身体太胖了。

starinheart

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Katie: Your body is too large, can you absolutely know that, that's true?

凯蒂：你的身体太胖了，你能百分百确定那是真的么？

Oprah: Well, I can't absolutely know that it's true,(Katie：Okay，so) because obviously it's serving a purpose.

奥普拉：好吧，我不能百分百确定那是真的。（凯蒂：好的，所以）。因为很明显它能够为我服务。

Katie: So, I invite you to commit to a Yes or a No.Cuz the work stops working the moment you stop answer the questions. What happens is the mind wants you to defend what you're believing, it wants to justify what you're believing. And, the work ,when you answer the questions  ,this cut through it. So commit to a Yes or a No.(Oprah: Yes or No?) ah-huh.

凯蒂：所以，我邀请你只是回答一个“是”或者“不是”，因为当你停止回答问题的时候，功课就已经不起作用了。因为那时候，你的头脑就开始防卫你所相信的，它想要证明你所相信的。而，功课，也就是你回答的这些问题，它可以直接切开这些混乱的思绪直指真相。所以让自己只是回答一个“是”或者“不是”。（奥普拉：是，还是不是呢？）啊哈。

Oprah: Too large for me, is the question?

奥普拉：这个身体对我来说太胖了，是这个问题吧？

Katie: Can you absolutely know that your body is too large?

凯蒂：你能百分百确定你的身体太胖了么？

Oprah:.....No.

奥普拉：嗯。。。不能。

Katie：Oh, you're amazing.

凯蒂：哦，你真令人着迷。

Oprah: You know the reason why? I can't , I can't be absolutely true that my body is too large because it is. It is, and it's working for me, and you know, it functioning. so I can't know that it absolutely is true.

奥普拉：你知道理由是什么么？我不能，我不能百分百确定我的身体太胖了，因为它就是这样的。它就是这样的，它对我来说是好用的。你知道，它各方面的功能都没有问题。所以我不能百分百确定那是真的。

Katie: Yeah, and not only that when..

凯蒂：是的，而且还不只那样。

Oprah: Well，I like it to be different? Yes, but that's not the question you ask.

奥普拉：但是，我确实想要变得不同啊。是的，但是那并不是你的问题。

Katie: No，that is different. It's like, who needs God when I have my opinion.(Oprah:mm-hmm)You know, I ~know my body is too large. and and it's it is arguing with reality,and it's it's a little strange for now. Let's move to the third one. How do you react, what happens to your life when you believe this thought? (Oprah: I..) Such a huge question.（Oprah: Yeah).And you answer for millions and millions  and millions and millions people going through this.

凯蒂：是的，这是不同的。那就像是说，当我已经打定主意的时候，谁还要听老天爷的意见呢。（奥普拉：嗯-嗯）你知道，我~~知道我的身材太胖了！那是，那是在与事实抗辩。现在已经有点儿奇怪了。让我们接着下面第三个问题。当你相信这个念头的时候，你有何反应，你的生活中发生了什么事？（奥普拉： 我。。）多么令人震动的一个问题啊。此刻，你正在替百万个、千万个、亿万个人穿越这个问题。

Oprah：Okay, I feel frustrated, um, you know, anxiety, I get, not， you know, anxious, not depressed because I feel um not good about myself, I feel like I should be doing better. And I should be doing better.

奥普拉：好吧，我感到很沮丧，嗯，你知道，紧张，我觉得，不，你知道，紧张，不是抑郁。但是我觉得自己感觉不太好，我觉得我应该做的更好。我应该更好才对。

Katie: And your mind shows you images. It compares you to, to a size 10, or a size 8. (Oprah:Yeah.). and you watch other people and you compare your body. That's how the mind works.(Oprah:Right.).And you believe your thought "my body is too large." (Oprah:I'm so sick of that, I'm so sick of that.) And you becomes sick of it. And then also how do we react，when you believe the thought our bodies are too large.(Oprah:We eat more.). We actually, we eat more. We become hopeless.(Oprah:That's right. Why we eat more? Cuz we want to feel better , not the fact of your bodies ) We're at war with this innocent(body).

凯蒂：然后你的头脑会显现出很多图像。它将你与另一个10码的身材、或者8码的身材的你进行对比。（奥普拉：是的）。然后，你会看到其他的人，然后你会将自己与他们比较身材。那就是头脑的运作形式。（奥普拉：对的）。于是，你相信了你的念头 “我的身体太胖了”。（奥普拉：我受够了，我受够了那个）。然后，你会觉得自己快受够了。然后，当我们相信了这个念头 “我们的身材太胖了”，我们会做什么？我们，我们实际上，，（奥普拉：我们吃得更多了。。），我们吃得更多了。我们觉得没有希望了。（奥普拉：知道为什么我们吃得更多了么？因为我们想感觉好点儿，不想面对身体的现实。。）于是，我们与这个无辜的身体开战。

starinheart

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作者：starinheart（来自豆瓣）
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Oprah: Yes.I'm talking to Byron Katie here, a woman who truly loves what is, author of loving what is, and she's working doing the working with me here literally.

奥普拉：是的。我正在访谈拜伦.凯蒂, 一个真正热爱现实的女人，《一念之转》的作者。实际上，她现在正在与我一起做功课。

Katie：So we see how we react when you believe the thought, and we even become bitter and some of us do become depressed. And who would you be? The fourth question, who would you be without the thought, (Oprah: I.. ) my body is too large?

凯蒂：所以，我们来看看当你相信了那个想法的时候，我们甚至更难受了，有些人会变得抑郁。第四个问题，没有那个想法的时候，你是谁？没有“我的身体太胖了”这个想法？（奥普拉：呃。。）

Oprah: i would be so joyful.(Katie: Yeah).I would be able to through my closet and get dressed in the morning, without thinking about what's gonna fit instead of.(katie: Yeah). You know.(Katie: Yeah, Imagine..)I would just move through the life and I wouldn't have this as an issue. I could let this go and ...

奥普拉：我将会变得很快乐啊，（凯蒂：是啊）。我会在早上穿过我的试衣间，找出一件衣服穿好，而不用考虑哪件衣服才适合我。（凯蒂：是啊）你知道。（凯蒂：是的，继续想象）。我会，我会顺利的生活，不会把身体看成一个问题。我会不在乎身材的问题，嗯。。。

Katie: And isn't that the very thing you want?

凯蒂：难道那不正是你想要的东西么？

Oprah: And I could give so much more energy to so many other things..

奥普拉：我会分出更多的精力，能做更多的事情。

Katie: And isn't that what you think you're gonna have when you are at the size 10,at the size 8?(Oprah:Yes!) I mean. I can skip all of that and have it from here, right here, right now.(Oprah:How am I gonna do that.)It's just simple. (Oprah:My body ,my body was too large..)That's ok.We are not there yet. So just to notice that ,with the thought，a lot of stress, without the thought..happy. (Oprah: What if I let go of that thought? I would be so much happier.) Okay. now I'm not asking you to let go off the thought.(Oprah:You're not.)I'm not even asking you to change it, I'm not asking anything, just your answers. So what we've learned  from you is, with the thoughts, stress and everything else that ,that we discussed(Oprah: Right.),without the thought,happiness,(Oprah: Right.).Joy, your mind not on the body.(Oprah: Right.)

凯蒂：难道，那不正是当你拥有10码或者8码的身材时，想要的东西么？（奥普拉：是啊。）我的意思是说，我可以跳过身体这个困扰，直接拥有这种状态，就在此时此地。（奥普拉：那我该怎么做呢？）很简单。（奥普拉：我的身材，我的身材太胖了啊。。）那没有关系。我们还没进行到那一段。所以，现在我们只需要注意到，当你相信了那个念头时，很多的压力涌上心头；没有那个念头时，快乐。（奥普拉：如果我放下这个念头呢？我就会变得更加快乐？）嗯，现在我并没有叫你放下那个念头。（奥普拉：你确实没有。）我甚至都没有叫你改变那个念头，我什么都没有要求，我只是要你的回答而已。所以，我从你这里了解到，相信了那些念头，就会充满压力以及一系列偏差的行为，我们刚才讨论过的。（奥普拉：是的）。而没有那个念头的时候，快乐，（奥普拉：是的），喜悦，你的心念不再被束缚在身材上面。（奥普拉：是的）。

Katie：Okay，so with the thought , stress, without the thought, no stress. So, how can the body be the problem?

凯蒂：好，所以有了那个念头，压力；没有那个念头，快乐。所以，身体怎么可能成为问题呢？

Oprah: My body is not the problem, it's what I about it. (Katie:Okay.) It's the problem

奥普拉：所以，我的身体不是问题，是我对它的看法才是问题。（凯蒂：是的）。那才是问题。

Katie：Okay, so let's go back to an example.Give me an example of the turnaround,"my body is not too large."

凯蒂：好的，那么让我回过头找个例子，给我一个实例证明反转的念头是真的，即 “我的身材不算太胖”。

Oprah：My body is not too large because it functions for me and allows me to be able to get up and move through life everyday, and speak to the world from a , from a sacred space. My body is not too large.

奥普拉：我的身材不算太胖，因为它对我来说非常有用，每天它都能让我起床，走动，说话，从我的智慧中说出想要说的话语。嗯，我的身材不算太胖。

starinheart

版权归作者所有，任何形式转载请联系作者。
作者：starinheart（来自豆瓣）
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Katie：It's not too large to be yours. It's too large to be hers, It's not large enough to be his or hers. This is right here right now,it is the perfect weight ,the perfect size to be you. It doesn't mean that you're not gonna be thinner next week.(Oprah:Okay). I only have one thing to deal with , what am I going to put in my mouth right here right now.(Oprah:mm-hmm). That's it. Not forever, just in this moment , and then I notice I eat what I eat, or I don't, and I'm just noticing noticing noticing.(Oprah:Yeah,be more conscious). And until then, I am the perfect size to be me. Somebody's got to be  you, Oprah. No else could do it. You are the one. And this is what it takes, but only right here right now.  

凯蒂: 它对你来说不算太胖。或许它对于她来说太胖了，或许对于他或她来说还不够胖。这是个此时此地的问题，它对于你是完美的体重，完美的尺码。但这并不是说你下周不会变瘦。（奥普拉：好的）。我只是说现在只有一件事需要关注，那就是我此时此地要吃入口中的是什么。（奥普拉：嗯）。就这么简单。不是说永远，而是就在这一刻，你所入口的是什么。然后，我会注意我吃了什么，或者我没吃什么，我只是留心地观察，观察，观察。（奥普拉：是的，更加清醒）。而在此之前，我的身材是完美的。世间总有一个人要成为奥普拉。没有其他任何一个其他人可以做奥普拉，因为你才是那个人。这就是你身材所承载的意义，成为此时此地的那个你。

Oprah: When you learn to do the inquiry of the work, which are the four questions," is it true?" "is it really true?(Katie:mm-hmm). The third one， I forgot...

奥普拉：当你学会功课的质询之后，即四个问题，“这是真的么？”，“那真的真的是真的么？”（凯蒂：嗯）第三个问题，哦我忘了。。

Katie: How do you react ,what happens to your life ,your entire life when you believe that thought？（Oprah：And the last one?）Who would you be without that thought.(Oprah:and then you turn it around) And then you turn it around.

凯蒂：当你相信那个念头的时候，你有何反应，你的生活中发生了什么。（奥普拉：最后一个问题？）没有那个念头你是谁？（奥普拉：然后，接着将念头反转。）接着，将念头反转。

Oprah: If you apply that to everything in your life..

奥普拉：如果你将功课应用在生活中的每一件事情中的时候。。

Katie: Then you wake up , you wake up to reality , you wake up . You know, this is about the end of suffering. You know, Oprah, if you , if,if heaven were the most marvelous marvelous place, everyone wants to go to heaven, or people that do and believe in it. If you died, and went to heaven where everything was perfect.There was no suffering, there was no sorrow ,there was no...(Oprah:Right) no misery.If you died and went to heaven and you took what you're believing  to heaven with you, where would you be? On earth! (Oprah: On earth.)

凯蒂：那么你就会觉醒，你就会觉醒于现实，你会觉醒过来。你知道，这是对痛苦的终结。你知道，奥普拉，如果你，如果天堂是最最美好的地方，每个人都想去天堂，或者对那些想去天堂和相信有天堂的人而言。如果你死了，去到了那个事事都完美的天堂。那里没有痛苦，没有悲伤，没有，，，嗯（奥普拉：对的），没有苦难。如果你死后去了天堂，然后带着所有那些你此刻所相信的念头去了天堂，那么你在哪儿？还是在地球上啊！（奥普拉：在地球上）。

Katie: So I woke up and I discovered heaven,I'm in heaven and I am inviting everyone to it. And and I can't take you there. But people who answer these four questions and a turnaround and sit and get very still ,can take them there, if their mind is just open to it.

凯蒂：所以我醒来了，我发现了天堂，我就在天堂，同时我邀请所有人来到这里。可是，可是我不能够把你带到那里。但是，那些能够回答这四个问题和一个反转的那些人们，能够真的静下心来回答问题的人们，如果他们的头脑和心足够开放的话，就可以将自己带到那里。

Oprah: The four queations and  loving what is , Byron Katie. It's been a joy  having you here. I mean really. All right , My body is fine the way it is.(Katie: In the moment.)  In this moment ,right now.

奥普拉：四个问题和一念之转，拜伦.凯蒂, 非常高兴能在这里访谈你，我意思是真的很高兴见到你。好吧，我的身体就是它该有的样子。（凯蒂：在这一刻）对，在这一刻，它在这一刻就是它该有的样子。

Katie: Arguing with it and you miss the beauty, miss the beauty of you and that certainly isn't like you.

凯蒂：与它抗辩，你会错过你自己本有的美丽，错过你自己的美丽，而那真的不是你的作风。

Oprah: Thank you.

奥普拉：谢谢。

【第二部分完，待续】 果冻.Angela  2018-4-6

starinheart

ok，第二部分:）

amy

拜伦.凯蒂：Oprah与Byron Kaite的访谈


视频地址：http://new-play.tudou.com/v/537454843.html?resourceId=0_06_02_99

starinheart

amy 发表于 2018-4-6 22:38
拜伦.凯蒂：Oprah与Byron Kaite的访谈

对，非常好的视频，就是这个视频。值得反复看。：）